Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board

The issue I have is that I fear his ceiling is quite low. We don’t expect players to be instant stars, that’s not what this is about. He doesn’t tackle, has no tank or pace. His big attribute is as an occasional goal sneak. Sure he’s a cult hero but when you view this in the cold light of day, Jack is nothing more than a pretty good depth player. His position is a hard one to play but look at everything Bobby, Beau or even Jamie does when they’re not hitting the scoreboard. Bobby doesn’t kick bags each week but he brings relentless pressure.

You tend to look for raw attributes in young draftees to see what they have and how it could all come together with hard work and maturity. I guess I don’t see how Jack adds extra strings to his bow. The instinctive ducking will risk him being pinged (which happened in the last quarter of one of our finals at a crucial time could’ve cost us a goal).

The whole cult hero thing is fine to a point but eventually you run the risk of simply being a mascot rather than a contributor. I don’t get how he’s inspirational. To my mind the best kind of inspiration is to have a player out there that isn’t tantamount to playing one short. I don’t buy this hype that he has a quasi-divine quality of getting our team up by virtue of his mere presence.

^ His goal-kicking "ceiling" is already above virtually every forward on our list. He hasn't turned 21, yet. What do you people expect?

eddiesmith wrote:

K wrote:

SwansWay wrote:Rumour reported that Ginni is possibly going to Hawthorn for a future first round pick. Need confirmation.

1st round?! Unless the Hawks zoom up the ladder, that's way overs! Can't be true!

First Rd pick is the minimum for a required and contracted player like Ginni with proven big game performances.

No club would ever give that. Top 10(ish) pick is the compo for star key forwards!

Gerry Cooper wrote:If he wants out then send him to Gold Coast. See how he likes that.

By all reports, he does not want out.

K wrote:...
Riley B reported that no club has approached Ginnivan so far. And Ginnivan's side won't want to approach them (said Riley). Both Riley and Twomey (his AFL podcast partner) said if they were Hawthorn they def would approach Ginnivan. Just to check it out.
...

He repeated this on Friday. So if there are interested clubs, they're leaving it till next week.

Pies4shaw wrote:^ His goal-kicking "ceiling" is already above virtually every forward on our list. He hasn't turned 21, yet. What do you people expect?

Jack Anthony and Jaidyn Stephenson say “Hold our beers!”

^ There's a smart-arse answer available for everything, isn't there?

Stephenson did not kick 40 goals in a season. Anthony did it once, playing full-forward (not HFF) - and only reached 40 goals in a season when he was a full year older than Ginnivan is at present (that is, two years older than Ginnivan was when he did it).

^ not smart arse at all.

Ginnivan was the beneficiary of being a relative unknown with opposition teams putting very little effort into stopping him. We saw the same with Anthony, Stephenson and Dawes.

His second year was less than stellar - didn't start well with the nose beers. Then he lost his place in the team and became essentially a sub. And his GF efforts were, at best, serviceable. Noting he was the only player on the ground without a contested possession.

Is he in our best 22 - maybe?

He's young and has time, but not as much time as he thinks. Especially if Schultz comes to Collingwood. He might be out of the team's forward line.

A "relative unknown"? No need to be silly about it - the AFL actually changed the rules to stop him.

I admire Ginni's skills around goals and his ability to read the play and be in the right spot at the right time. He also is a very accurate kick for goal. These are all attributes which we need. However, his goal return since his first year dried up considerably, after the AFL ordered umpires not to pay him frees for head high tackles. If he is to remain in our team he needs to supplement his already valuable skills with significantly increased fitness and defensive mindedness. Providing he does that he should retain a spot in our best 23. If not, next year may well be his last season in black and white.

Is this thread still going?

Ginni has football smarts you can't teach, which more than make up for his lack of express pace and tackling. He's not there to be a defensive forward, he's a goal kicker and a link up player.

As he matures, physically and mentally, his ceiling is very high. Yeah he has areas of improvement, who doesn't at 20?

The people who are in the best position to rate him, started him on the ground in the GF. Nuff said.

^ you only have to wait until close of business on the 18th October and the matter at hand can be closed one way or another.

Pies4shaw wrote:^ There's a smart-arse answer available for everything, isn't there?

Stephenson did not kick 40 goals in a season. Anthony did it once, playing full-forward (not HFF) - and only reached 40 goals in a season when he was a full year older than Ginnivan is at present (that is, two years older than Ginnivan was when he did it).

Well Stevo kicked 38 but if you want to split hairs go ahead. I wasn’t being a smart arse but rather illustrating a point. I know you’ve knocked our recruiting of Bobby Hill and even past the beginning of the season, went so far as to say he’s a much less impressive player than Ginni when you compared their statistical averages and put him down as being second fiddle to Jack. How well did that age?

Yes like you I was frustrated at his treatment last year. He came up with a clever way to draw frees. That being said, when it came out that he boasted about practicing it, I didn’t like that. And after a while I didn’t like that his slipping in tackles was his main avenue to goal. He overplayed his hand imo.

Selwood was frustrating but he had plenty of other elements to his game. I feel like Ginni’s head high frees were like 90% of his effectiveness. I’m happy to be proven wrong. In fact it’s great for us if am wrong. But I would simply need to have some thick rose-coloured glasses to believe the contrary.

Should have had two goals in the GF from limited opportunities, off the back of two quarters of football in 8 weeks.

He’ll be an asset next season off another pre season.

Ginni is being groomed now as a a high HFF, not a goal sneak like he started in his first year. I reckon the plan is for him to play midfield / high HFF going forwards cause he has footy smarts - he just needs the tank.

That's why he's such a good sub - he can play 70% of the ground for about 30% of the game!

I wouldn't be too worried about him fitting into our forward line with Schultz, I'd be thinking goal kicking midfielder.

- Ben

K wrote:

eddiesmith wrote:

K wrote: 1st round?! Unless the Hawks zoom up the ladder, that's way overs! Can't be true!

First Rd pick is the minimum for a required and contracted player like Ginni with proven big game performances.

No club would ever give that. Top 10(ish) pick is the compo for star key forwards!


[.

No they’d command multiple first rd picks.

What'sinaname wrote: And his GF efforts were, at best, serviceable. Noting he was the only player on the ground without a contested possession.

That's pretty damning really isn't it? I hadn't read that before.